Building a Practice Out of What Already Exists: Meet Shirt, the conceptual artist and rapper.

I first met SHIRT at the Available Works Book Fair in New York this past spring. His booth stopped me in my tracks: a rack of re-purposed clothing hung like artifacts—one piece in particular, a classic grey Champion sweatshirt draped in a sparkling mesh overlay, pulled me in. SHIRT introduced himself immediately, and our quick hello turned into a conversation, then into weeks of emails and a phone call. I’m excited to share this interview and his mind-at-work with you.

What were the formative experiences—musical, visual, or cultural—that shaped your transition into working both as a rapper and a conceptual artist?

For me, it was realizing certain people existed and were doing certain things. Maybe you had to be me and in my shoes experiencing this stuff to fully understand how it shaped me. I think first it was certain songs hitting in the 90’s. This realization that there were people writing and rapping their ideas, bare, over these ill ass beats. I have a synesthesia I think too, so those colors together when you think of certain records. Magic-hour-blue rap songs, or like a brown, green, and dark blue music. But then ‘conceptual art’ too, in the last 10-15 years. Again, it’s sometimes the epiphany for me that certain people did this altering thing.

What do you do after learning David Hammons sold these snowballs he meticulously rolled? Or that Lorraine O’ Grady photographed people in the street during the African American Day Parade in Harlem holding empty frames up referring to themselves as the art? And that's in 1983 alone! What does one do when first coming to the work of an artist like Rirkrit Tiravanija? Or Jadakiss? Or Marcel Duchamp and Papo Colo? Or Arthur Jafa and Jai Paul or Adrian Piper? Or Sophie Calle or Mach Hommy? I can keep going....

Favorite artists or artworks function like milestones in my upbringing akin to learning to walk. People learn to walk and realize they can really be out. I realized I could use ways of thinking and making to achieve these aims I had. It’s not some little thing these people were able to pull off, bringing new ideas out and then changing the world around them even slightly.

As a young guy rapping, I listened to and studied flows and words put together from Biggie, Nas, Ma$e. Then Jay-Z, or earlier than that people like Heavy D. I thought it was so ill that Mobb Deep, Calvin Klein, and all these cool ass people and I went to the same High School of Art & Design. Later my taste expanded to include all kinds of other music. Naming any of it ‘conceptual art’ came way later, finding people like John Baldessarri, Pope.L. Getting super interested in Kenneth Goldsmith’s concept of using language already written. Going crazy for Arthur Jafa when I came to him. Félix González-Torres. Legacy Russell or Ka's work...

But you know, there’s coming to stuff, which we all do in ways. But then what I really did and decided to do early on, was actually read the fine print, so to say. If something caught my eye or a word or a visual got my attention somehow, there was a real effort on my part of taking this stuff seriously. Like nah wait, there’s people that live and make work like this, make some money from this, and are respected as real artists doing this?? There’s institutions and organizations working toward supporting people like this?? These people put themselves out there and work through ideas similar to what I’ve come to?? All of this made me think it was important for me to continue down this path. And the path, you know, this path you create...it does change you as you walk it. Which comes back to your ‘formative’ question—I think doing it period, is formative. All of it is, last week was formative.

Your work spans installation, performance, video, writing, physical work, clothing, ideas etc. How do you decide which medium best fits a particular idea you want to explore? Do you have one you prefer over another?

I try not to do much deciding but more listening! I guess recently I’ve thought I prefer mediums that seem accessible for people. I’m not super interested in making via elaborate machinery or stuff that seems really out of reach for me or just about everyone else. I want to make stuff with my voice, your voice, our voices together, with some paper, with stuff around us, with really low to no cost stuff, with people, with friends, with lovers, with social media friends. What’s cool is making stuff with others can totally include complex machinery if that’s what someone comes to the table with, you know? But I guess I’m not so into stuff I feel is a closed door kind of thing.

Actually, those are the complex machines I want to work with somehow! That's a good goal.

I love that your work has an undercurrent of circularity without it being so in your face. Could you tell me a bit more about your views on sustainability and fashion and how your work crosses over into that realm?

I just think for certain things—I don’t have all the data—but for certain things like clothing let’s say—I really don’t think we should be producing new pieces when there’s so many clothes in piles around the world. What should be happening is cleaning and recycling and upcycling that stuff. Actually, those are the complex machines I want to work with somehow! There’s a good goal. We should be using what we already have and currently don’t use effectively to make new things we want. My work crosses into this realm because I love certain clothes and pieces, and love people’s individual fashion sense and what people do with fabrics and silhouettes and putting that shit on. But I’m also like sick to my stomach when I think about the billions of dollars spent every year producing yet more and more garments. It’s wrong and needs to stop ASAP across the industry. I straight don’t want to make new clothes with a brand––we can absolutely do better. I can walk and chew gum at the same time, you know? There’s a lot that’s super awful in the world but this masturbatory high fashion or fast fashion shit like “let’s produce cheap clothes in boatloads” is really not it.

You have a “Clothing” category among your works. What do you think of garments—as objects, as canvases, or as messages? What role does clothing play in your expression?

Yeah I love some clothing to death. A big wool coat, some yellow construction Timbs, good white tees. There's a black cashmere sweater I want to make maybe. Lately I've been doing these leather pants I found. I don't really look at garments like canvases. They’re garments. People can treat their garment like it's a whatever, that’s up to them. But to me a canvas is a canvas, a hoodie is a hoodie etc. I think certain messages and design works better on clothing and on these moving pieces part of an outfit on a person, than for instance how they might work on a static canvas hung on a wall somewhere. Those are different utilities, how you interact with them is maybe different. Then I think there’s some stuff and different forms that work better on a canvas to me. It depends on the language and the gesture of an artist maybe. Again, how you want the work to operate, and on what register. Part of making work can be presenting the work, in my opinion. I know that for a work to function as a work, it doesn’t necessarily need to be presented. But presenting the work, and the work being received by someone else, could very well be part of the work. If that makes sense.

You have an affinity for Sea World hats. Can you tell me more about those and where you can purchase them? How do you source them?

Lol I wouldn’t say I have an affinity for Seaworld hats! Haha. I mean, they’re cool. I realized somebody went crazzzzyy making Seaworld hats in the 90’s and 2000’s. There are some amazing ones out there. So you know, what to do about that, if anything? For me the idea that hit was to embroider the word 'CLOSE' on the front for this idea ‘CLOSE SEAWORLD’ - as in shut that shit down. If you’ve been following about it, Seaworld has been called out many times with evidence of horrific mistreatment of animals in their care. So I learn of this fact and it gets lodged somewhere, right? Something I care about that I can call attention to at some point in some effective way (if I get the chance). Then years later I find out there’s all of these amazing hats that were made. So because I understand how to let a kind of staraightforward idea happen…I slowly acquire hat after hat, over like a year. I collected like 30 hats before I started embroidering them and have done close to 60+ hats now. I mostly use the internet to find them, but I’ve also found some in real life! I love shopping thrift and vintage and do it around the world every chance I get.

Tell me a bit about Facade Foundation: how do you go about choosing the location and artists?

Facade Foundation is a nonprofit I'm helping to build that turns active scaffolding at construction sites into large-scale public art installations all over New York City. I was the first featured artist and we exhibited my photograph titled Whole Worlds You Never See a Block Over From Where You Normally Walk, 2025, printed to scaffold netting on a brownstone in Fort Greene in April 2025, for a few months. Since then there's been two new additional installations in Brooklyn, one of a large-scale reproduction of a June Canedo de Souza painting on Fort Greene Park that was exhibited for some months in Fall, and a third installation featuring a new Anthony Akinbola work that was unveiled in Clinton Hill and will remain through February 2026. There will be more I can share soon! The team is working hard and on instagram @FacadeFoundation / and the web at facadefoundation.org

What would you consider a dream project / opportunity?

A dream would be to do some of this stuff for a good and long time and with more resources. There's nothing more fulfilling to me than living life collaborating with others around important causes, fly ideas, and our shared interests. But that's not to say that working as I have been, or many of us have, isn't beyond taxing. None of it comes easy and I got fight stories to tell. I want more for us and my people. There's a new world coming I want to help create and I start with myself and my own corners first. But so much of what I've gotten to do have been dream projects. I really only can't wait until wayyyyyyyyy more of us have more resources to go even wider. People need a little faith and a long runway.

What’s in store for 2026?

Well, fuck all lying ass ceasefire talk, I need ‘a free us’. Free Palestine, free Congo, free Sudan, free people from all imperial grips around the world. Free healthcare, free us from our social conditioning and bullshit ways of thinking we subscribe to. I am unsubscribingggggggggg . I can’t read your question and just think up the cool shit I have coming. I immediately think I don’t know what the evil powers that be have in store to come. What horrors and grave injustices still to come. What man-made disasters and war and pain and blunders still to come. As long as I’m alive I’ll be working to try and share what I consider the real.

I’m also hoping to see this thing all the way through for a good long time, you know? My life. You never know. And I’m sure 2026 will be amazing in ways, there’s already dates I’m super looking forward to on the calendar throughout it. But then it’s the years to come after I’m also really excited about. So much cool stuff to make happen and do to the best of our ability ,which is constantly expanding. Fuck the calendar, we make the dates.

THANK YOU SHIRT!

You can find Shirt's work on his website, Instagram, and Store.